There is a reason I've disavowed Twitter in all it's shapes and forms. Screw that place.
I'm pumped for Bad Batch. I'm a life long Star Wars fanatic, and my 9 year old (half native daughter) is one too. We are looking to jump into the show this weekend.
Rebels ended up being an amazing addition to the canon, though it took a bit to warm up to. I imagine Bad Batch may be similar. It's cool though to see the characters from Clone Wars continue their journeys, especially since Caleb is part of the situation as well - and given he has a part to play, that means we may have some small extension to Mandalorian now also. I'm excited to see how the universe grows outside the Skywalkers - it all feels wonderfully Star Wars RPG in a way, new characters making their own way, no matter what color their skin, lekku or lightsabers are.
Oh, and as for representation, I think anyone would be hard pressed to say Disney has a history of racist/sexist behaviors in ANY aspect of their eras of Star Wars. Women and POC are well represented now, especially in the hispanic community. I love seeing latinx individuals and women getting starring roles, and as the universe grows, I'm sure we'll continue seeing more than just boring ol' white folk to contend with. Hell, the vast majority of VILLAINS continue to be white dudes - thank God Moff Gideon was there to demonstrate that badass humans from non white producing one environment planets do exist in the Empire also.
Anyway, I digress. Twitter is a cancer, and continues to demonstrate that most people shouldn't have a public platform on which to share their opinions.
But that said, my little Star Wars freak (whose favorite character is a non white female by the name of Sabine Wren) will continue to be there giving us a Galaxy Far Far Away to look forward to.
Whitewashing is not just replacing characters of color with white people, it’s also attempting to pass off characters with white features as people of color. Take that terrible Exodus movie from last decade. The characters were Egyptian and Hebrew according to the film. By your logic, that would mean the characters weren’t whitewashed even though they were portrayed onscreen by white people. Not only that, but in-universe explanations for whitewashed designs are irrelevant. The writers didn’t have to make them whiter; they chose to do that. Yes, they’re mutants, but they didn’t have to be white mutants. It’s called the Thermian effect. Do you know how easy it would be to keep their complexions consistent with the other clones? They have the other clone models right there to reference. This could have been fixed (for the most part; there’s still the issues of hair textures and facial structures) simply by using the eyedropper tool. They wanted to make the Bad Batch different, but they didn’t consider how certain differences (like lighter skin) could have unfortunate implications. There were plenty of ways to make them stand out besides whitewashing them.
I don't think there is any instance of trying to pass of white characters as people of color in this show. You're kind of disproving your own point here.
I didn't say white characters, I said characters with white features. Which is what the Bad Batch is doing. Māori men do not look like the Bad Batch, even if they have genetic abberations.
These are not Maori men. They're Clones in the Star Wars universe. The fact that a (not full-blooded) Maori man played Jango is meaningless. This is a fictional universe. We don't have clone troopers in our universe.
You’re right, Māori don’t exist in Star Wars. But Jango Fett is played by a man of Māori descent in live action. The clones are genetic copies of him, even imperfect copies like the Bad Batch. Therefore, for the sake of internal consistency, they should appear as though they originated genetically from an individual of Māori descent.
It's almost like you keep forgetting this is a cartoon and nothing about its design or animation is based on realism whatsoever. Seriously, you need to stop trying so hard to be upset by this shit.
I am not trying very hard at all to be upset by this. You, however, seem very annoyed, and I have no trouble believing that comes easily to you. You see, I used to be like you. I know from experience that you feel irked that "the libs" are telling you something you like has racist elements in it. But here's the thing: this is an issue that can be easily corrected, and nobody has to lose their career over it. There's no mob trying to cancel such-and-such writer or character designer, only a group of people trying to bring this issue to their attention. Unwhitewashing the Bad Batch will be an improvement at best and neutral change at worst, so there's no reason to oppose it. Let me state something I hope we both agree on. White people and other races are equal. We agree on this, yes? It follows that if a show is willing to portray white people accurately and realistically, it should also portray its characters of color with an equal degree of accuracy. Because the Bad Batch has been whitewashed out of laziness and a lack of research and critical thinking, it demonstrates that the creators of the show do not think characters of color are worth representing correctly. They are an "other." The animators are used to rendering white characters, so they render characters of color the same way despite the fact that there are different requirements for accurately rendering nonwhite characters. That is a mark of poor artistic integrity. There's nothing wrong with admitting that.
Nice try, but you can't pull the reverse racism card here. Here are two objective facts. Fact #1: The Bad Batch are portrayed as superior to other clones. This is the premise of the characters. They are a group of genetically aberrant clones selected for their, and I quote, "desirable mutations." This is stated in the show and its prequel The Clone Wars where The Bad Batch was introduced, therefore this cannot be argued against. Fact #2: The Bad Batch are lighter-skinned than the other clone troopers in the show. This can be verifiably proven by referencing the official character model sheets, which display the characters in neutral lighting, and therefore also cannot be argued against. There is a link implied by these two facts: light skin is a desirable mutation that makes these clones superior to their "ordinary" brethren. As we both know, light skin does not equal superiority in the real world, but as long as this group of "enhanced clones" with "desirable mutations" are portrayed with lighter skin than their counterparts, that is the message that the show is sending. The only character in the Bad Batch whose skin tone is consistent with the other clones is Wrecker. Wrecker is big, loud, dumb, and prone to violence to a greater degree than the other clones, including those in his own squadron. Since Wrecker is the darkest member of the group, it implies that he is uncouth, unintelligent and violent as a result of his skin color. This contrast is reinforced by the fact that Tech, the lightest skinned member of the group aside from Echo, is the most intelligent, smallest, and most fastidious out of these characters. Again, we both know there is no real-world link between skin color and intelligence, politeness, or aggression, but again, that is the message the show is sending. If the Bad Batch's character models were updated, removing Objective Fact #2 from the equation, there would no longer be an implied message that men with whiter features are superior to brown men. And if that doesn't convince you that this easily resolvable issue is worth addressing, it's also better from a storytelling perspective. Stories are better when they are consistent, and currently, the Bad Batch's designs are not consistent with their origins (mutated clones of Jango Fett, a character portrayed onscreen by a Māori actor, who has brown skin, dark eyes, and curly black hair) or with real-world genetics (because if the creators had done research in that area, they would know that whiter skin is not a mutation these characters would acquire unintentionally as a result of experimentation.)
Your second fact isn't true. A couple of them are lighter skinned. A couple of them are the same skin tone. It's almost as if the skin tone is totally immaterial to the actual "superior" genetic traits in question here (shock!) You're wrong about Wrecker also. Hunter is every bit as dark, and he's the central character/leader of the Bad Batch. And bringing Echo into any of this (he's a Reg) is arguing in bad faith since there are explicit reasons for his pallid skin.
Mutated clones will, by definition, not look like other clones. Skin tone is just one tiny piece of the picture, but one you've fixated on to the detriment of your enjoyment of the story itself.
But by all means, keep saying "objective fact" as though this will get anyone to take you seriously.
Hunter’s undertone is pink, not brown. Wrecker is the only one whose skin tone is consistent with the other clones. Again, this is verifiable by their character sheets.
Also, regarding Echo: that is not how skin actually works. He is brown, and therefore his skin would not be completely bleached under the conditions he underwent. It would be a stretch even if he was white to begin with. Furthermore, I believe I have already mentioned the Thermian effect; you should research it. An in-universe explanation is not an acceptable excuse for an author to make a story harmful decision. Echo did not have to be bleached; the writers chose to do that. There were plenty of other— and actually realistic— ways to show the effects of Techno Union experimentation. Echo’s bleached skin demonstrates a lack of research on non-white dermatology, which is essential when designing a non-white character. It is a mistake. To defend it is arrogance.
I'm not angry at all.
There is a reason I've disavowed Twitter in all it's shapes and forms. Screw that place.
I'm pumped for Bad Batch. I'm a life long Star Wars fanatic, and my 9 year old (half native daughter) is one too. We are looking to jump into the show this weekend.
Rebels ended up being an amazing addition to the canon, though it took a bit to warm up to. I imagine Bad Batch may be similar. It's cool though to see the characters from Clone Wars continue their journeys, especially since Caleb is part of the situation as well - and given he has a part to play, that means we may have some small extension to Mandalorian now also. I'm excited to see how the universe grows outside the Skywalkers - it all feels wonderfully Star Wars RPG in a way, new characters making their own way, no matter what color their skin, lekku or lightsabers are.
Oh, and as for representation, I think anyone would be hard pressed to say Disney has a history of racist/sexist behaviors in ANY aspect of their eras of Star Wars. Women and POC are well represented now, especially in the hispanic community. I love seeing latinx individuals and women getting starring roles, and as the universe grows, I'm sure we'll continue seeing more than just boring ol' white folk to contend with. Hell, the vast majority of VILLAINS continue to be white dudes - thank God Moff Gideon was there to demonstrate that badass humans from non white producing one environment planets do exist in the Empire also.
Anyway, I digress. Twitter is a cancer, and continues to demonstrate that most people shouldn't have a public platform on which to share their opinions.
But that said, my little Star Wars freak (whose favorite character is a non white female by the name of Sabine Wren) will continue to be there giving us a Galaxy Far Far Away to look forward to.
I literally do not care about Star Wars anymore, not after the house of Mickey Mouse gobbled it up.
Whitewashing is not just replacing characters of color with white people, it’s also attempting to pass off characters with white features as people of color. Take that terrible Exodus movie from last decade. The characters were Egyptian and Hebrew according to the film. By your logic, that would mean the characters weren’t whitewashed even though they were portrayed onscreen by white people. Not only that, but in-universe explanations for whitewashed designs are irrelevant. The writers didn’t have to make them whiter; they chose to do that. Yes, they’re mutants, but they didn’t have to be white mutants. It’s called the Thermian effect. Do you know how easy it would be to keep their complexions consistent with the other clones? They have the other clone models right there to reference. This could have been fixed (for the most part; there’s still the issues of hair textures and facial structures) simply by using the eyedropper tool. They wanted to make the Bad Batch different, but they didn’t consider how certain differences (like lighter skin) could have unfortunate implications. There were plenty of ways to make them stand out besides whitewashing them.
I don't think there is any instance of trying to pass of white characters as people of color in this show. You're kind of disproving your own point here.
I didn't say white characters, I said characters with white features. Which is what the Bad Batch is doing. Māori men do not look like the Bad Batch, even if they have genetic abberations.
These are not Maori men. They're Clones in the Star Wars universe. The fact that a (not full-blooded) Maori man played Jango is meaningless. This is a fictional universe. We don't have clone troopers in our universe.
You’re right, Māori don’t exist in Star Wars. But Jango Fett is played by a man of Māori descent in live action. The clones are genetic copies of him, even imperfect copies like the Bad Batch. Therefore, for the sake of internal consistency, they should appear as though they originated genetically from an individual of Māori descent.
It's almost like you keep forgetting this is a cartoon and nothing about its design or animation is based on realism whatsoever. Seriously, you need to stop trying so hard to be upset by this shit.
I am not trying very hard at all to be upset by this. You, however, seem very annoyed, and I have no trouble believing that comes easily to you. You see, I used to be like you. I know from experience that you feel irked that "the libs" are telling you something you like has racist elements in it. But here's the thing: this is an issue that can be easily corrected, and nobody has to lose their career over it. There's no mob trying to cancel such-and-such writer or character designer, only a group of people trying to bring this issue to their attention. Unwhitewashing the Bad Batch will be an improvement at best and neutral change at worst, so there's no reason to oppose it. Let me state something I hope we both agree on. White people and other races are equal. We agree on this, yes? It follows that if a show is willing to portray white people accurately and realistically, it should also portray its characters of color with an equal degree of accuracy. Because the Bad Batch has been whitewashed out of laziness and a lack of research and critical thinking, it demonstrates that the creators of the show do not think characters of color are worth representing correctly. They are an "other." The animators are used to rendering white characters, so they render characters of color the same way despite the fact that there are different requirements for accurately rendering nonwhite characters. That is a mark of poor artistic integrity. There's nothing wrong with admitting that.
Nice try, but you can't pull the reverse racism card here. Here are two objective facts. Fact #1: The Bad Batch are portrayed as superior to other clones. This is the premise of the characters. They are a group of genetically aberrant clones selected for their, and I quote, "desirable mutations." This is stated in the show and its prequel The Clone Wars where The Bad Batch was introduced, therefore this cannot be argued against. Fact #2: The Bad Batch are lighter-skinned than the other clone troopers in the show. This can be verifiably proven by referencing the official character model sheets, which display the characters in neutral lighting, and therefore also cannot be argued against. There is a link implied by these two facts: light skin is a desirable mutation that makes these clones superior to their "ordinary" brethren. As we both know, light skin does not equal superiority in the real world, but as long as this group of "enhanced clones" with "desirable mutations" are portrayed with lighter skin than their counterparts, that is the message that the show is sending. The only character in the Bad Batch whose skin tone is consistent with the other clones is Wrecker. Wrecker is big, loud, dumb, and prone to violence to a greater degree than the other clones, including those in his own squadron. Since Wrecker is the darkest member of the group, it implies that he is uncouth, unintelligent and violent as a result of his skin color. This contrast is reinforced by the fact that Tech, the lightest skinned member of the group aside from Echo, is the most intelligent, smallest, and most fastidious out of these characters. Again, we both know there is no real-world link between skin color and intelligence, politeness, or aggression, but again, that is the message the show is sending. If the Bad Batch's character models were updated, removing Objective Fact #2 from the equation, there would no longer be an implied message that men with whiter features are superior to brown men. And if that doesn't convince you that this easily resolvable issue is worth addressing, it's also better from a storytelling perspective. Stories are better when they are consistent, and currently, the Bad Batch's designs are not consistent with their origins (mutated clones of Jango Fett, a character portrayed onscreen by a Māori actor, who has brown skin, dark eyes, and curly black hair) or with real-world genetics (because if the creators had done research in that area, they would know that whiter skin is not a mutation these characters would acquire unintentionally as a result of experimentation.)
Your second fact isn't true. A couple of them are lighter skinned. A couple of them are the same skin tone. It's almost as if the skin tone is totally immaterial to the actual "superior" genetic traits in question here (shock!) You're wrong about Wrecker also. Hunter is every bit as dark, and he's the central character/leader of the Bad Batch. And bringing Echo into any of this (he's a Reg) is arguing in bad faith since there are explicit reasons for his pallid skin.
Mutated clones will, by definition, not look like other clones. Skin tone is just one tiny piece of the picture, but one you've fixated on to the detriment of your enjoyment of the story itself.
But by all means, keep saying "objective fact" as though this will get anyone to take you seriously.
Hunter’s undertone is pink, not brown. Wrecker is the only one whose skin tone is consistent with the other clones. Again, this is verifiable by their character sheets.
Also, regarding Echo: that is not how skin actually works. He is brown, and therefore his skin would not be completely bleached under the conditions he underwent. It would be a stretch even if he was white to begin with. Furthermore, I believe I have already mentioned the Thermian effect; you should research it. An in-universe explanation is not an acceptable excuse for an author to make a story harmful decision. Echo did not have to be bleached; the writers chose to do that. There were plenty of other— and actually realistic— ways to show the effects of Techno Union experimentation. Echo’s bleached skin demonstrates a lack of research on non-white dermatology, which is essential when designing a non-white character. It is a mistake. To defend it is arrogance.